Not Old v. Young, But Wealth Warfare

Here I am - Tired and exhausted from the fight, but willing to raise my voice for those who may be waiting for an answer.

I will begin by stating as I did in the debate, that I do not agree that a public website should post private issues.

I am not in support of the methods used on HV - I am simply here because this is the ONLY site where we can post and make our voices heard.

I am truly "Da Fence."

Good Fences make Good Neighbors, and our goal is to build bridges for communication and consensus among ALL of our Vienna Citizens.

Our Team was shocked, dismayed and disappointed with the final vote count. We worked tirelessly and faithfully for a change in our Council and for our Future.

We were, in the end, resoundly defeated. My sadness tonight is not for myself - Rather for the Town of Vienna.

We are spinning in circles, with no desitination or direction.

If we fail to plan, we plan to fail.

This is truly a sad day in Mudville.

No Sunshine in the immediate forecast, DB

DB, you will never separate people and personalities from politics. Do you think Clinton and Obama will simply debate issues as they seek the nomination? No, they will rightfully examine each other hard and surely truth and fiction will be thrown back and forth. That's part of our process. And sometimes in all the noise the electorate get it wrong, get fooled or don't give a shit. That's life.

Create another web site that tries to remove "people" and have just "issues" and no one will come as it will appear censored when the most important information is left out. Character counts. People's actions and words, especially if they are elected leaders or appointed board members, mean a great deal. What politicians do for a living means much to voters as you just found out. Place of employment seems like it might fall under the definition of "personal", but its all part of the process.

Look at the big lie thrown your way for months, "DB is a developer who will ruin Vienna." This website did not cause that. The people who sit on Vienna Town Council orchestrated that and the effect and negativity thrown your way from those sources blow away any of the small amount of content assembled here online. They just did it in the shadows. So to anyone why does the Town Council and their board members get a pass on this subject? The evidence on this web site in their words and video is not fiction. It was the reason this site was created.

So instead of saying you don't like the tactics of this website, say it for all of the Vienna political system. You will then have a clear position everyone in Vienna can see.

I too was surprised by the election results. Between our two tents I saw what I believe is Vienna, and that is smiles and families. I too am sorry for the citizens of Vienna who saw what our vision was, and that was people walking to the dress shop, the Irish pub and other "kitchy stores". With the development of Tysons a lot of people will not want to go there and deal with the construction. I believed that this is/was a perfect time for Vienna to come into its own. Now for as long as long as there is this hold on us we will only see broken sidewalks and more banks. I have said that while I do not always agree with the way HV goes about everything I understand the reason it exists. It exists because there is no light shining onto the TC. But rather then kill the messenger because you don't agree with everything I say look at the whole message. Things are not always black or white. And if we do not look at the whole context before condemning something, than we do not educate ourselves. Even after the election, I am not in charge nor own this website. But I will say that after the display I saw by the elected officials toward any challengers I say thank goodness there is some light to be shone. By the end of the day I too Deborah was developing all over Vienna, and I was building a 10 story building where Giant is.
Susan Stich

>>The older people want no change while at the same time its happening all around - mostly unplanned.

Agreed! Have you seen that very ugly new building behind the strip mall on Pleasant Street near Maple? Welcome to unplanned Vienna.

>>Our Team was shocked, dismayed and disappointed with the final vote count.

I would not be surprised to learn that the vote was corrupt.

>>No Sunshine in the immediate forecast, DB

The Sun is shining here!

>>Create another web site that tries to remove "people" and have just "issues" and no one will come as it will appear censored when the most important information is left out.

Exactly!

>>I will say that after the display I saw by the elected officials toward any challengers I say thank goodness there is some light to be shone.

Maud is such a sweet little old lady!

Deborah -- Start your own blog. I'd read it. I think your campaign had promise.

Susan -- Your phone call backfired, big-time. I'm 37, and I was offended by the age-baiting. Negative campaigning isn't working in Virginia -- just ask Jerry Kilgore and Leslie Byrne, who both lost winnable races in 2005. If you want to make a difference in Vienna, you'll need to try different tactics, and you might need to keep this blog at arm's length, at least.

Original post -- I like what I've seen of Staats' work, though I'd like to know what's going on with the overgrown vacant lot on Glyndon that had a Staats sign for a while. I think many of the builders in this area make an effort to respect the character of the neighborhood. Park has a few houses that really shouldn't be there, including that giant house that was on the market for many months. (Has it sold yet?)

But you're way off on a "wealth divide" in Vienna, and the fixed-income slap is just another bully tactic, like the age-baiting. So now you're not just targeting the old folks, you're targeting those of us in our 30s who aren't in million-dollar homes. Hardly a good way to get your point across.

Re-read the Money magazine Best Place to Live story, and you'll see that they're fond of Vienna's historical properties and that they lament the fast rise in the median home price. They also compliment Madison High and the abundance of good jobs nearby. I wouldn't lay all the credit at the developers' feet.

"So now you're not just targeting the old folks, you're targeting those of us in our 30s who aren't in million-dollar homes...Park has a few houses that really shouldn't be there, including that giant house that was on the market for many months. (Has it sold yet?)"

Thank you for making the wealth divide point. Why should the houses on Park not be there? Because you can't afford them? If you don't like your current lot in life, can't you work harder as opposed to coveting your neighbor's big house on Park Street?

We also love the way you call them "developers"...you once again play right into the whole wealth divide. To try and make the case that Vienna would have made any #4 ranking without the hundreds of new homes built by these hard working and creative people is baseless. Those new homes are the inspiration for where Vienna is going whether you like it or not.

Lastly, and this is where people like yourself fall down with sanctimonious BS, can you name a historical property in Vienna? Name one property in this Town on a State or National historical register. Hint: you can't.

Words means things, which you clearly know. So while you preach your agenda with an air of "having it all figured out", maybe one day you will start addressing specifics. This site was not created to win elections. It was created to get the truth out.

The giant house on Park shouldn't be there because it's an eyesore. If you want truth, here it is -- People went to the open house to laugh at it.

If you're young and rich, congratulations. But if you're buying an ostentatious house and writing a blog just to scream that fact to the world, you've probably lost sight of what's important in life.

Again -- Staats has done some nice work, and I'm sure those houses ain't cheap. That's not the issue. There are nice expensive houses, and then there are huge houses crammed onto a lot with little sense of style and character. Thankfully, Vienna still has more of the former than the latter. (I don't know which houses the Brehonys have built, so I can't judge.)

Historic property -- Freeman House. Nice place. And I love the Historic District, too.

I'm not convinced you're getting the truth out here. I think you're just beating your chest and yelling at old, slightly less money-obsessed people to get out of your way. I fail to see how that's constructive, and I think Brehony and Stich's failure to distance themselves from it cost them.

"People went to the open house to laugh at it."

People went to see a house that ended up selling for over $2 million to laugh at it? Murphy I wonder if someone considers your house an eyesore? Ostentatious? Well, no need discussing whether wealth divides (and the politics that entails) exist in Vienna, Murphy has cleared that up. You also said:

"Historic property -- Freeman House. Nice place. And I love the Historic District, too."

The Freeman House is on what historic register? Was preserved under what guidelines? Love the historic district you say, but can you even define it? You think the idea of subjecting homeowners to a set of non-existent guidelines and moving properties in and out of the boundary on whims is fair? Any specifics you can add to the debate or is this all touchy feely historic huggy stuff regardless as to whether it tramples private property rights or not?

Work harder Murphy. Work smarter. America is a country where you can make your dreams come true if you don't spend too much time envying your neighbor and whining.

PS. Love your argument where so-called "rich" (how is that defined anyway?) don't know what's important in life. Class warfare 101!

SO by your logic about the Freeman House, if I can make my house look old, sell some old stuff in there, I can call it historic. Wow, that's just great.

Folks, that's exactly what they did. I don't mind the Freeman House either, but don't tell me it has anything to do with preserving Vienna's true history, because it doesn't.

The only true historic homes/buildings that have all been torn down, could have been preserved with the appropriate and requisite guidelines put forward by the extensive study the TOV paid for years ago, but was any of it done?

NO

So, what I find offensive is that I get the police sent out to my house just because I wanted to repair a section of my fence that had been hit a by a car driving off the road. You call that fair?

NOT.

It's just a bunch of garden clubbers who take your money and play house and gossip.

That's a far cry from having anything to do with preserving real homes. Anyone can open up a shop and sell old things, but to call that preserving history is a flat out lie.

Oh, and by the way, if anyone with the town wanted to tear down all the sides, fences, and porch and change them compleetely to make it look like a McDonalds with arches and paint it bright yellow, there is nothing in the code that can make them stop.

But homes in the HD that are only 5 years old, have to come before a board with no guidelines and from one night to the next, they will decide whether you get to fix, repair, alter, or do whatever you want, as long as they like you and they think your work is historic. Laughable. No rules, no guidelines, completely up to whose favorite ideal of the day is, and that's what you get. On one occasion, I heard on of the board members state that they thought a persons proposed change was going to result with too much white, the very next week, too little white...

No reasons, no rules, just rule-making on the fly.

WRONG

I'm not sure if this is what you're intending, but you come across as someone who made his money and is hell-bent on making everyone else cater to his whim.

I'm actually wondering why you want to live in Vienna. There are hundreds of places in Fairfax County where you can do pretty much whatever you please. No historic district, no quaint little Church Street to preserve, not even a quaint little Vienna Inn to preserve. (And I'll say again -- I want to preserve the Vienna Inn as much as anyone, and I don't know you insist on alienating people who would otherwise fight with you to save it.)

I don't envy my neighbors, and I find it rather amusing that you assume I would. Quite the contrary. I'm grateful every day that I'm able to live here. If I wanted a bigger house, I could have one -- perhaps I could even tear down this one and build something a little bigger. But why?

I'm not envious of others living the American dream while I'm stuck in a tiny house watching American Idol. I'm living the American dream. I live in a beautiful town with friendly neighbors, a charming line of shops on Church and a convenient array of restaurants on Maple. I have a good job and good prospects, and most importantly, a happy family.

I wouldn't mind reforming a few things. Sure, the Council meetings should be televised. Yes, more sidewalks would be nice. Maple could be planned a little better.

And I'd happily join a conversation on all that. It's just not happening here. Since you've pretty much admitted that you're just out to expose "the truth" about people you hate because of some property dispute, I guess I can take my leave.

Deborah, Susan -- If you're still reading, I hope you've found this thread of comments interesting. I hope it helps you gain some insight into the mindset of a Vienna voter who has no particular ax to grind but cherishes above just about all else the basic civility of this town. I hope it has convinced you that no good can come of the attack politics this blog brings forward, and I hope you'll stay active in public life.

"Since you've pretty much admitted that you're just out to expose "the truth" about people you hate because of some property dispute..."

Well, that is an interesting piece of imagination!

Back to the issue at hand, would you care to address any of the questions posed? Or is your answer nothing, but just declare that you love your family. Can't argue with that! In logic terms it is a classic Chewbacca defense. Quite good actually.

Murph you are not only addressing the candidates but also the almost nine hundred persons that voted for them. You are dismissing the fact that there are people in town other than the owners of this blog who see a need for change. Drive your car in the garage and close the door. Then go to Le Canard and enjoy your meal.
Regarding the house on Park St. Perhaps the Abrahams historic house that stood there before was more to your liking. The house as it stands fits well with the land. Don't you have the acumen to envision the house surrounded by more mature trees. The town did with their Town Green depiction on the Parks and Rec catalog.

Rumor has it that 401 Park St., SE (circa 1900) and 409 Park St., SE (circa 1925) are being negotiated for sale and development by a prolific builder in town. The total 1.5 acre should accomodate ..... five houses(?) Are these homes historic enough? They'll build homes with basements dug so deep that the sump pumps never stop even after it hasn't rained in seven days.

I believe it is Lewes Deleware where they have moved. What will become of the house and gigantic trees at 917 Park St. SE?

>>> I don't envy my neighbors..

>>> I'm not envious...

>>> I'm living the American dream.

- Murphy

Regarding: No historic district, no quaint little Church Street to preserve, not even a quaint little Vienna Inn to preserve

How in the world do you think anyone in this town is trying to preserve anything historic in Vienna?

There is no historic district. Yes the town has adopted a boundary and this artificial boundary includes many homes, most of them under 10 years old, and some older. But to think you are preserving anything historic, please tell me how? The HD was formed for two reasons. One, to keep commercial sprawl out of the NW quadrant. Two, to keep "unwanted persons from buying into said same area", and that meant Black Americans. So, you can have your racist HD, I don't want anything about it, and I will fight to have it completely abolished.

How in the world can you say there is anything being preserved on Church Street? The Freeman Store? Build a small store, make it look old, and sell a bunch of things inside that talk about Vienna, is nice, but it's not preserving anything remotely historic. I recommend you investigate several of the many sites online that talk in great detail about what historic preservation is all about. Vienna has done none of the requisite things to abide by what is needed to engage in preserving Vienna's historic homes and commercial interests. In fact, anything that could have really been preserved has been torn down.

The old post office: gone.
The old fire station: gone, now Bazin's.
Moorefield Home: gone, and this was even on the National Registry of Historic Homes.

So, don't tell me Vienna is doing anything legally or seriously about preserving it's history. Mind you I like what is being done on church street, and I like Vienna, save for the corruption.

What I will fight to end are the ARB and the Windover Heights Historic Review Board. Both of these boards are simply designed and operating so that a handful of Maud's Friends can decide who gets what in this town, and who gets to live in the NW quadrant. If you think I am wrong, you haven't done you homework. Both of these boards are illegal, and will eventually be struck down in the court system, unless someone in the TC realizes this and does the right thing.

Crybabies you say? Simply a smoke-screen that doesn't work.

I am not trying to change anything you and I like about Vienna. I like it the way it is, but to apply arbitrary and capricious decisions by a small handful of carefully selected cronies just because they can, is not legal, and shouldn't be allowed to continue.

DO your homework. From where I sit, we are going to continue the fight for justice. Losing an election maybe a setback, but not a loss.

I'm just a happy person living my American Dream in Vienna, Virginia. Nothing needs to be better or changed.

In fact, if things *did* get better, I probably couldn't afford to stay here. I'm secretly happy that we are stuck in stagnation. If downtown Vienna looked like it could be, I'd be forced to move while even more million dollar houses are built.

So, here's the deal, if you have money, please just move to McLean or Great Falls so I can live my American Dream in SW Vienna. I like knowing that I don't have to look for a better job, get more education or work longer hours.

Thank you!

At the recent election, I voted for the two challengers and for the "new" councilman who had been on the TC for only a year. I did so simply to support an effort to shake things up a bit. I saw all the candidates' campaign literature and saw almost no specifics (except for term limits--a great idea). No offense, but if the two challengers want to get elected next year, they might want to offer some clearer distinctions between themselves and the Old Guard--in plain, stark terms. Yes, we all want to "preserve Vienna's charm", whatever that means. Tell us how you will do it. What EXACTLY will you do about traffic, considering that we are wedged between Fairfax City, Tysons Corner, the Metro station, and I-66? Give us something besides platitudes. Give the Old Guard something specific to answer to. Stir things up a bit. Maybe you'll get elected next time.

I'll sign off by saying I find it amusing that people are assuming all sorts of things about me, particularly in terms of education. I'd tell you the answers, but since I've already been advised to kill myself, I think I'd rather end my association with the folks here, not encourage it.

And I'm sorry to disappoint you, but I don't have a garage.