Here's How the Old Lady Consolidates Power

Reminds me of the Catholic Church's old practice of charging for "indulgences."

>>>>Interesting. The Vienna Zoning Director believes that appealing a corrupt law, along with corrupt enforcement, is a SERVICE?

Deconstruct useless government. Eliminate the historic district charade and save everybody a lot of time and money. Let the historic society review board go prune flowers in their Freeman Store clubhouse back yard. Or how about charging those jokers some user fees for all of the Town services they get to run their fluff piece historic society... lease and maintenance on the Freeman Store building, groundskeeping, IT support for their e-mail and Internet services, policing, etc, etc, etc... bunch of free-loaders clubbing on our tax dollars! Make them pay some damn equity, Maud, you fraud! They raise money for their private club on our dime... what a joke, fairness! If anybody goes to the fee hearing, ask Town Council how much money Town taxpayers contribute each year in goods and services to Historic Vienna, Inc.... and how much money does Historic Vienna pay the Town of Vienna each year in USER FEES! Ask the {...]s on Town Council to speak to THAT taxpayer inequity! Historic Vienna, Inc. costs Town taxpayers far far more each year than the handful of residents forced to abide by the inequity that is the Windover Heights Historic District. And then there is that small matter of the Town wasting tons of taxpayer equity in a legal defense of an illegal historic district that is part and parcel to Historic Vienna, Inc. Get the historic garden clubbers out of Town government... let them pay their own expenses... Vote, Vienna!

Sounds like they're trying to shut you up and shut you down.

I'm willing to be that there's going to be some wording that will allow friends of the council a pass on the new fees...

Keep in mind, there are basically NO re-zoning requests in Vienna. Bukont's recent ones were the first in years. That said, the Town views the act of asking for removal from their historic district as a zoning change - hence that request would now cost $2000.

So what is the point of this proposed action if there are essentially no re-zonings in Vienna? It's surely not designed to raise legitimate money, there is no volume. This proposed action is what you do when you happen to be an angry, embarrassed, bitter, eighty something year old member of Town Council and frankly have nothing better to do with your time than use the power of government to settle personal scores.

This proposed action lets Maud and Jane (Gomer and Goober) exert power and show the historic district complainers who is the boss. It is entirely punitive, disguised as a fee applicable to all residents, with the Council knowing full well it effectively ONLY targets those unhappy with a corrupt historic district.

It is an action that shows the true colors and pettiness of a rather simple minded group of immoral and unethical {...]s. Does anyone really think that Greg Hembree, the Town Zoning Administrator, came up with this idea on his own? What will Mr. Hembree say about all of this under deposition?

If Maud was 35, and not working under the sympathy play of being 85, would anyone tolerate this? Doubtful. Stay tuned Vienna, the mother of all embarrassments is yet to come. When the lid is lifted off Maud's BS over this issue in court, it will make her recent poll worker sham seem like child's play.

**** you. I win!

The increases are necessary to bring the town's fees more in line with those charged by nearby jurisdictions and more accurately reflect the costs of legal advertising and labor performed by town employees...

1. More in line with other jurisdictions? Does any other jurisdiction have a corrupt historic district?

2. Labor performed? Are not Town employees already paid a salary? Isn't being at these meetings part of their salary? How and why do they need an extra tax to pay them more?

"...accurately reflect the costs of legal advertising and labor performed by town employees..."

What?!?!
What advertising? The signs that were forced on us?

Legal advertising?? What the heck does that mean?

Labor? For the special pickup prior to the "walk on the hill"?
That comes out of our yearly 2, that we already pay for with other taxes?

Does this imply that because we live in the hysterical district we are afforded special privileges?
Name 1!

Follow this logic...if you live in the Windover Heights Historic District you are forced to appear before this Board by the Town. When you fill in the application there is no fee charged. But if you go before their review board and you lose and you want to appeal...you now have to pay the Council $250 to appeal to the Council. That is BS.

Ok, I'm sure I could find the answer to this if I read deep enough on this site, but I'm too lazy to do that. So here's my question:

What is the argument that "the other side" (across the table from you) makes FOR the historic district? That is, what is the identified "value" that is "added" (and to what is it added) by having the district?

I mean, it seems to me that, at least from a utilitarian standpoint, you don't do something unless it adds some sort of "value" to some sort of equation. So I'm just asking what is the "value," and what is the "equation"?

Just trying to understand.

They never say more than this bit from Vienna Code:

"Windover Heights Historic District: The purpose of this ordinance is to recognize and designate by an overlay to the Zoning Map of the Town of Vienna the Windover Heights Historic District of the Town, which District contains buildings and places in which historic events occurred and which have special public value because of notable architectural features and other features which relate to the cultural and artistic heritage of Vienna, and to provide for the preservation of that District and sites therein; the Town Council recognizing that the District is a single family residential neighborhood which has changed little since the turn of the century, which consists mostly of older homes, open spaces and meandering streets lined with mature trees and shrubs which constitutes one of the original residential sections of historic old Vienna and which housed citizens who were prominent in the development of the Town of Vienna."

Isn't that a special piece of prose from Maud's now deceased husband?

How about a little critical thinking...

1. When they created this District in 1979, they did no inventory of structures in the District as mandated by their own Code. Almost all of the neighborhood has since been torn down or rebuilt extensively into new structures. There is no baseline to measure from. "Buildings and places" never defined.

2. "[N]otable architectural features" never defined.

3. No preservation of "sites" in the District has occurred since this District is not about preservation. Laurie Cole asked the Town Zoning Administrator at a BZA hearing:

"The Town's designation of the Windover Heights area as an historic area, does that impose any strictures [restrictions] on subdividing land, tearing down houses, protecting houses. Its not a preservation district is it?"

The Town Zoning Administrator responded:

"No. It's not. A good example is 308 West Street which was removed perhaps 2 years ago and there are two new homes in its place."

Laurie Cole clearly knows this is not about historic preservation. So does the Town Zoning Administrator. Recall the former Town Attorney's memo from 1998:

"The act of including or not including the property in the historic District is not a zoning or rezoning action and therefore, cannot be spot zoning. The age of the structure has no bearing on whether or not it should be included in the district. Your attention is invited to Section 18-280.2 of the Town's zoning ordinance concerning the boundaries of the Windover Heights Historic district. You will note that it is a historic district created by boundary and makes no reference to the age or character of the structures within the boundary. I have always maintained that if Abraham Lincoln had been assassinated at the local Giant, that structure would be historic. One the other hand, the mayor's antique chicken house is very old, but in my mind has no historic value."

And it goes on and on...one big joke.

I mean, it seems to me that, at least from a utilitarian standpoint, you don't do something unless it adds some sort of "value" to some sort of equation.

The value to them is the ability to have a loosely worded law enabling them to dole out goodies to those they like and to dole out sh*t sandwiches to those they don't like. They are not deep thinkers, but rather impulsive people bent on "winning" and keeping control of their government. They realize that to question the historic district is to question the commercial ARB too and so on down the line of Vienna's amateur hour code (which happens to be a great deal of Charlie Robinson's doing). As long as everything stays "loose" they can keep power. That's the equation. If anyone thinks their true motivations are about historic districts or historic preservation, well, go smoke some more crack.

Adam:

The added value for the other side is complete control. A few neighbors were worried about losing what they liked (narrow streets, foliage, large lots) and the HD keeps them squarely in charge.

Personally, the charm has worn off now that I have kids and desperately want sidewalks. When I was a kid, the roads were not like they are today. These people fly down Windover 40-50-60 MPH and it's deadly. The only reason no one has been killed is that hardly anyone walks around. I would be all over the place if I felt safe in my own 'hood.

And, I guess, they have the ability to stop any kind of house like the big brick palaces on Berry. I know Maud would sooner die than have one of those invade her HD.

You know what's missing? In the midst of the specifics outlined here, we need Shirley Damon's boy Steve Rigby to reappear and say some more of nothing.

Years ago there was an attempt by the town to curb FOIA requests by upping the charge for xerox page to two dollars. Are they still charging two dollars?

RE: changed little since the turn of the century, which consists mostly of older homes...

This is laughable. Almost 99% of the homes have changed almost completely, and most have been built or rebuilt within the past 10-15 years, and can hardly be viewed or proven in court that they are "older homes..."

This is nothing but a glorified homeowners association gone awry, and for all practical purposes, its design was to allow a bunch of Maud's friends and cronies to decide who got to do what with their homes and property, and in some cases, who was actually allowed to move into this area. Yes, it was used to discriminate, as to who could buy a house in the area... don't believe, ask the Leggett family.

Vienna Mommy, Re"I know Maud would sooner die than have one of those invade her HD."

This has nothing to do as to whether Maud likes or dislikes her HD. It's all about power and abuse. You get some poor sap who probably doesn't like their job, family life, or whatever, and they get into a position of power over their neighbors, and then their fun begins. they get to decide what abuses and violations of liberties they are going to instill upon you when you have to go before them to do what any other citizen in Virginia gets without all this crap. These people seem to revel in the ability to abuse rights and freedoms, and the fact that they have been allowed to get away with this behavior for so many years has gotten them to think that they aren't really hurting anyone. I think, for the most part, they actually enjoy being mean and ornery... it gives them a sense of power, which makes them feel useful, albeit sickly, but useful in a world where their own humdrum lives are but a cog in big wheel. Like lemmings over a cliff, they are.

These people, for the most part, know that this is all wrong. Steve Bukont once gave a well chosen little speech about how Vienna's politicians were violating citizens rights and homeowners freedoms were being violated at one of the work sessions. Maud almost had a brain stroke, then and there.

Steve resigned shortly thereafter, but not before he just about recanted everything he said earlier. Why did he do this? Was this a power play? Was this blackmail? Was this a trade-off? Inquiring minds would like to know.

MAUDE ROBINSON IS AN ARROGANT LIAR AND THE REST OF THE COUNCIL ISN'T FAR BEHIND SINCE THEY ARE AFRAID TO OPPOSE HER. AS TO GREG HEMBREE, HE IS JUST A BUREAUCRAT SLUG.

Thanks for getting back to me on my question, "Maud's Buddy," Historic Vienna, and vienna mommy. Much appreciated.

-- Adam

guess schoeberlein can't comment any more on this issue...as it might lend credibility to the idea that there are big time problems? plus dad is going to be part of historic lawsuits.

Ok, "No Surprise":

(1) I don't have an opinion because I don't, as of yet, understand the arguments from one side or the other. A thousand people a day bring "unconstitutionally vague" lawsuits. I don't know the basis of the suit, because no one would supply me with the pleadings that I requested, and I really don't care enough to pay a courier out-of-pocket to fetch them for me from the county courthouse. Unlike you, I choose not to render judgment on incomplete fact patterns, innuendo, and bias.

(2) I don't give two sh*ts WHO you name in your lawsuits. So bark up a different tree, dummy. Go ahead and name EVERY town employee, for all I care. The more you name, the dumber you look. And PLEASE, supply me with enough information for me to give an opinion. And then give me the oral argument date for the day you try to attribute what I think to my father -- I want to take the day off so I can be there to see the argument, just so I can see the judge ridicule you and your lawyer for having made THAT argument.

Love,
Adam

Why don't you just read the Town Code regarding the Windover Heights Historic District? It doesn't take much legal ability to see what the problems are.

Town Code section for historic districts.

Sure thing. What section(s)?

Oops, HV anticipated my question. Sorry about that, too quick on the draw, I guess. Give me a chance to read it now ....

Okay, I've read the sections posted above. That didn't help. Sorry. I'm sure I'll read about it in the local papers when the case(s) is (are) decided.

What do you mean it didn't help? You see no problems with that? You are an attorney?

You saw there are no guidelines, no rules for deciding what gets built or modified and what doesn't?

As the guy who claims no association with Vienna government, you just punted and showed you are not about to say anything that hurts the Town.

Is that what your complaint says in the lawsuit(s)?

COMES NOW before this honorable Court, by and through his undersigned counsel, 'Surprise, Surprise, Surprise," with a prayer for declaratory and injunctive relief against the Town of Vienna and 47 other individuals on the grounds that there are no guidelines, no rules for deciding what gets built or modified and what doesn't in the historic district.

1. Just read the code. It's obvious.

Counts

2. It's unconstitutional.

Prayer for Relief

a. Injunction
b. Declaratory Judgment that it's unconstitutional.

Submitted this 18th day of June, 2007,

Surprise Surprise Surprise, Esq.

Good luck with that.

p.s. Yes, I'm a lawyer -- what does that have to do with anything?

hey agree with adam man...how can we give you an opinion about historic whatever is afair or not. this all you got?

The issues on the historic district are clear. If anyone is too lazy to read, that is a choice.