The Snail Government Takes Action

They need a survey to realize there is a problem? Unreal!!

We are now calling it a Pedestrian District as well? This is a street riddled not only with parking problems, but visibility problems for pedestrians and motorists as well. The crosswalk that starts this newly anointed Pedestrian District on Church and Lawyers has been the home to how many pedestrian incidents? A Pedestrian District to me is something like a Mall area, where it is closed off to cars. A Pedestrian District is a place where people can freely walk with out feeling endangered by cars.
Unfortunately the Mayor and TC can call this area anything they want, and they do, but in all honesty it is one more thing that is based on deception.

Looks like they got the cart before the horse and the horse is dead. Looks like trial and error rather than intelligent planning. Tuesday at 1230 PM a large tractor trailer was parked on the traveled portion of the roadway in front of Bazin's unloading a delivery. This is the second time I have encountered this situation. The first time there were several near miss accident situations. WTH

Susan: Pedestrian malls that are closed to cars rarely are successful. it is extremely difficult to operate businesses on streets that are closed to cars. back in the 1960s a lot of these malls were built in cities around the country & nearly all of them failed because businesses will not locate in them.

But on the topic of Malls Charlottesville is having a resurgence in their Down town Mall area. Anne my point was not weather or not a Mall was successful or not, my point was what this area is now being called. It is attempting to denote a safe walking experience. How can an area be deemed Pedestrian Friendly when there is a lack of visibility for cars and walkers. This is not even taking into consideration the narrow crumbling sidewalks that are difficult to navigate.

I hate to defend anything the town "leaders" do, since I generally think they're a bunch of morons, but on this one, I do think Church St is as much a pedestrian area as any. It's no less safe than, say M St in Georgetown or King St in ALexandria, or the Champs de Elysees in Paris. All are pedestian areas, but all have significant traffic as well. I really don't see the traffic on Church St to be that much of a problem. I do wish the sidewalks were wider, and if I were starting from scratch, I would have put in planting strips between the street and sidewalk, but it is what it is.

Addressing Charlottesville, most experts say that pedestrian malls can be successful when you have large numbers of either students or tourists--or both. Hence the success of the malls in Charlottesville, Boulder, CO, Lincoln Rd in Miami Beach, and the one in Ithaca, NY. There are probably a few others but the failures are much more common.

Ann, please list the failures. If you do not think Church Street is a danger stand around the ice cream parlor some warm evening and watch their patrons crossing the street to their cars in a private parking lot. Just 15 minutes will prove how the jaywalkers are in danger. Church Street is a sow's ear as is Maple Avenue.

If I read Anne right she is saying relatively speaking Church Street is a small issue to Vienna's larger problems. A one block commercial section may or may not be a huge problem, but the entire Maple Avenue is a disaster.

HV, what i mean is that traffic and danger to pedestrians on Church St doesn't begin to compare to that of most thriving pedestrian districts in other places. Sow's Ear says that jaywalkers are in danger, but that's what rules are for. you aren't SUPPOSED to dash out in front of traffic. Get your ice cream, wait a few seconds for traffic to clear, then walk to your car. If we expect every business to provide on-site parking, or that the town should prevent cars from access to Church St, we will have another failure of a business/pedestrian district.

Sow's Ear,
Many American cities had pedestrian mall failures: F St in Washington, DC was the local one. Pittsburgh, PA; Muncie, In; and Raleigh, NC are a few I'm personally familiar with. about 200 were built, most in the 1960s, and today very few remain because they just didn't work.

btw, does anyone know if there is a "business improvement district" on Church St? If not, the business leaders there ought to start one.

What is a "business improvement district"?

Church Street was rezoned in the 1990s with incentives added. That brought us the 3 new buildings. The same process was started for Maple Avenue. Maud killed it.

A BID essentially serves the same purpose as the management of a shopping mall. Business owners get together & collectively do things like advertise the district, hold events, take care of sidewalk maintenance, things like street planters, signage standards, etc. Right now, the town does some of these things, and does them poorly & without considering the best interest of the business district. A BID also provides a unified voice when dealing with the local government. In the case of Church St, this would probably be the most important function.